Architecture, And: Chief Strategy Officer, Laura Sachtleben

A Welcome to Practice Disrupted, a podcast where we find ways to create new solutions to current challenges while elevating the value of architects. I'm your host, Evelyn Lee, an architect who spans tech as an angel investor, startup advisor, and founder of Practice of Architecture. Whether you're a seasoned architect or just starting in the field, this podcast is your gateway to think differently about the role architects play within our global community.

A Hello, disruptors.

A Welcome to this week's episode of Practice Disrupted. Today I'm joined by Laura Sachleben, a leader whose career arc challenges the idea of what it means to stay on the path. Laura spent two decades in practice, rising to vice president and global sector leader of education, science, and technology at Stantec. By every measure, she had reached the pinnacle of a successful architecture career. But rather than settle into that role, Laura embraced a different kind of growth. She took time to reflect, explore, and reimagine what fulfillment in her career could look like. That exploration led her to Landscape Forms, where she now serves as Chief Strategy Officer, guiding a company dedicated to design, culture, and sustainability. Some may see this as a late career pivot, but Laura doesn't frame it that way.

A For her, this was the next evolution, building on everything she learned in architecture while stepping into new challenges that keep her growing. In this episode, we'll talk about what it means to leave a career you love, the courage it takes to chart a new course, and how Laura continues to mentor and advocate for the profession and even from outside of traditional practice.

B Hi, Laura. Welcome to Practice Disrupted. Thank you so much for joining us.

C Thank you for having me. I'm excited to talk to you today.

B I think the first time we met in person, I want to say, was back in 2000. Was it 2004 already?

C Probably. I mean, it's been a while. Yeah.

B 2004 in Houston at the Women in Architecture WIA event in AIA Houston. And it was interesting, interesting to me because I had a lot of conversations with younger individuals that are always interested in my path and how to step away from architecture. And you were at a very interesting juncture in your path in architecture. So that's what we're going to cover now. But I think we need to start from a little bit, from the beginning, because you had a very successful career as an architect. So what made you want to become an architect?

C Well, you know, I've heard a lot of people say this, but I knew from when I was in sixth grade that I wanted to be an architect. And, you know, I think it was interesting for me. I was always very Artsy. I played the violin for nine years. I was very into painting and drawing and doing all those things. But I had a dad who had a PhD in chemistry, a mom who is a microbiologist. So being an artist was probably not in the cards for me. And so I also, in sixth grade, I had a.

C My best friend. Her dad was an architect, and he had designed their house, which I spent the night at all the time. It was this really unique house. It had elements that he had repurposed from older buildings and other things. And I just thought that was the coolest thing I'd ever seen. And so I think that's all it really took was that exposure to someone who was in a profession that had all sorts of, you know, skills and restrictions. And it was very much a quote unquote profession, but there was so much creativity in it. And that really just got me intrigued.

C And so from that moment on, I went on the path, right? We all are told that there's this one traditional path, and that's what I jumped on. It always was really interesting to me. My very first design studio in college. So at Texas A and M, the professor said, he stopped us and he said, now look around this room, because maybe one of you is going to become an architect. Not very many of you are actually going to become an architect. And we just thought he was crazy. And as I look at it now, he was absolutely right. So many people found their way pretty early onto other paths, and there was very few of us that really stuck to that traditional path.

B Coming out of school, how big was the class? Just because. For size sake. Because I graduated from Drury University and so there's only 20 of us, 20, 25 of us in a graduating class. So tell us a little bit more about.

C Yeah, I don't know the size, but I mean, I think Texas A and M now is. Don't quote me on this, but I want to say 70,000 students. I mean, it's a huge university. Of course, architecture is not that big, but it was a large class. I don't know the number of architecture graduates, but it was more than 20, I can tell you that.

B I was going to say it would just be interesting. I always want the kind of the size comparison when he says only 1% of you are going to become architects. 1% of what? So you talked about the path. So tell us you not only went to Texas and A and M, you went on and get your M arc from Tulane too. So I feel like you doubled down on the path. Let's walk that with you.

C Yeah. Well, I think part of it is I am a lifelong learner and so I love nothing more than being in school. If I could do it forever, I probably would have. I graduated from A and M, I got out, got a job and I knew that I was going to come back in. Now, of course, A and M was set up where there was a four year undergraduate and then a two year graduate degree. But I knew that I wanted to have a different perspective in my two different degrees, which is why I went to Tulane. Texas A and M is, you know, I would say a more nuts and bolts practical in terms of, you know, they're more technical in their curriculum, whereas Tulane tends to be more on the design philosophical side. Both have elements of both.

C Right. But you see programs that lean more heavily towards one side or the other. And I liked that juxtaposition of those two different things. I also worked in between the two degrees, which was hugely helpful for me as well because as I stepped into, you know, the second degree, I was bringing more real world experience with me that helped me kind of continue to know where I wanted to chart my path and dig in. Yeah.

B It's interesting to me because you say, like to have the real world experience coming into a more thought driven design thinking school is also kind of an interesting contrast as well.

C Yes. And you know, and I, I don't want anybody to walk away to think that both of those schools don't have both of those things. They absolutely do, but they're a little different.

B No. And I think it's just a matter of also what you want to learn and what you want to practice and what you want to get out of it. I also think, frankly, I mean, in California we have the bubble schools and then we have our technical schools. And I won't go into which accredited programs fall into which buckets. But it's a common, I think, distinction that is often made between architecture schools. Anyways, so tell us about your decision to go into practice after getting your Master's.

C So what's interesting about my story is that job that I took in between my undergraduate and graduate degrees is the same job I went back to after and was the same job I left when I decided to make the departure out of architecture. So people are kind of surprised to learn. I tell them that my job at Landscape Forms is my second job. That's not including all the jobs you do when you're in college and ahead of in high school and all those things. And obviously I worked during college for smaller firms and for the architecture department. But I started with that company. They kind of kept tabs on me when I was in grad school and I was excited to come back. And that's where I stayed.

C And I grew up. I'm really fortunate in that I had 20 years with one firm, but I experienced, I think, a lot of different firms in one because of the evolution of that firm in the time that I was there. So when I first joined, There were 12 people, 12 or 13 people in our Houston office. You know, the firm was bigger than Houston, but it was a very small firm feel. And then we kind of grew to a mid sized firm with offices all over Texas and up in Michigan, Michigan and Virginia. I became a partner of that firm. We were focused 100% on education. And then about six months after that, we were acquired by Stantec, which is a very large multidisciplinary firm.

C And so when I look at my experience in one job, you got the.

B Small to the large.

C I did, I did. And so I think that was a part of my, you know, the steps in my career path as well. The decisions that I made was because I had, you know, I had already seen a full spectrum and I eventually started looking for something else. Right.

B So for all intents and purposes, it's interesting to hear. So you've had just to frame it for our listeners. So you got your Bachelor of Environmental design from Texas A and M. You went and got your mark from Tulane and you spent 20 years in practice, for all intents and purposes, working at a small, medium and being a principal or associate principal at a small, medium and large firm and what that entails, Primarily focused, I would say, in K12, although I imagine that might have grown a little bit at stantec.

C Yeah, but not by much. I mean, I, at the top point in Stantec, I was vice president and the global sector leader of education and science and technology. So throughout my entire career, education was at the core of that. Science and technology became a part of it. But again, all in that same realm.

B You made vice president. Why consider something else now? What was that influx point for you, having spent all those years at one firm? But also, I mean, I was looking at your LinkedIn. You know, the last eight years was after the acquisition of Stantech. So it wasn't, it wasn't necessarily like we got acquired by a big firm and I wanted to start looking elsewhere. You were looking living it at the time.

C I was, I was. And, and I was enjoying it and I was doing great things. You Know, my transition, it was, I can pinpoint where kind of like that first the seed was planted right about, maybe there's something, a different path. But it was a very gradual process for me. I think when it started was actually when I stepped into the role of the global sector leader for education and S and T. And I love that position. So don't get me wrong there. I loved what I was doing.

C I love the people I was working with. The projects I was doing were impactful and they took me to all sorts of amazing places. You know, from my own backyard to Bermuda and working with the government of Bermuda. And so all of that was, was incredible. But I'm a, I'm a lifelong learner and I'm a planner by nature. And so I'm always charting my path to the next thing. Where is my personal growth, what am I learning, what is that next thing? And that position was kind of the pinnacle of, of where I saw myself in the organization. And once I got there, I very slowly started to realize I'm not working towards the next thing anymore.

C And so all of a sudden the things, you know, where I was getting a lot of energy from it before it was starting to pull the energy and that had nothing to do with the organization or the people. In fact, that was the hardest part for me to part with because I feel so strongly about the people that I work with and the projects that I do and all of that. But getting to that realization that I just was in a different place in my life and in my career, that I needed to go seek something else out.

B And you said it was gradual. And the interesting thing is I've been talking to a lot of firms about what it means to create career ladders so people can play like people. And especially Gen Zers, I think, you know, want to know, want to plan a path and want to understand what's next in their career. Would there have been an opportunity if stantec was like create whatever the next position is for you where you might have like thought about what, what could potentially be next with within the organization rather than stepping out and trying something new completely?

C I think it's a valid question. And honestly, you know, there were, there were conversations about that, right? Could there be something else within that organization? But like I said, I had been through this progression from a very small firm to a really large firm. When I was in grad school, I worked for a one person firm too. So I'd done all that. And so it really wasn't about the firm, it was about Me and my next challenge and being able to kind of recognize that, and that's really hard. When you are successful at something, it's really hard to look yourself in the mirror and say, I'm not gonna. I need to go do something else. Because that just.

C It goes against every logic that you have, you know, of being good at something and keeping doing it. But I think when you hit a point where, for whatever reason, it's not bringing you the energy that it used to and you don't have the same passion around it, then it's. It's better for me to hand that off to somebody else. Right. And for me to go off and find whatever that next thing is. And for me, it really was. I knew that whatever I was looking for was going to be very different. So I don't think it was going to exist in that firm.

C And as it turns out, it didn't even exist in traditional architecture anymore.

B Why don't you tell us a little bit more about your current position, and then we'll kind of back into how you found your way there.

C Yeah. So I am currently the Chief Strategy Officer for Landscape Forms. Landscape Forms designs and manufactures outdoor furnishings. So that includes everything from outdoor furniture to lighting. We have a Studio 431 Customs Division, a structure division, and so we really focus on connecting people to the outdoors and connecting them to that outdoor environment. Our foundation is really around design, culture, craft. And for me, you know, when I was looking for that next thing, I came upon this company who spoke the same language that I had framed my entire career around. You know, design, culture, craft, sustainability.

C Those are all things that, you know, I deeply believe in. And so while I didn't have the experience in the manufacturing world, I certainly had the passion around what they stand for and how they approach their work. And so, you know, it was kind of this perfect marriage of, I need to learn something, but I have something to contribute as well.

B That's amazing that you found that alignment with values. I feel like that's what so many of us are looking for these days. So how did you begin that search? Evie talked a little bit earlier about how hard it is to step away from something you love, and it actually didn't take you too long because it was looking at your career transition on your LinkedIn site. It. Six months actually isn't very, very long for, like, what is essentially a decent career transition. So what did you do with that, that time in between?

C So the first thing I did is I said, I'm going to take time off and you know, like I said, I'm a planner by nature. So I had kind of slowly been building up to the idea that I might need, you know, that I might want to do something different and I need to prepare myself financially. You know, I have young children and I can't just not work for six months. But I, you know, in some of that planning I was able to set the stage for that. And so I did. I said I'm going to take three to six months off. I actually started at landscape forms one day shy of that six month window. So when I say I'm going to do something, I make sure I do it.

C But the first thing I did is I kind of cut all ties. And by that I mean I didn't take any meetings or conversations about open positions. If you ever want to see what's out there in the world, just put on LinkedIn that you've left your current position and the calls will start coming.

B You didn't want to be enticed into another architecture, back into another architecture firm.

C Well, and I didn't close the door that the next step was in architecture, but I didn't want to assume that that was the answer. So I really took time to myself. I met with a lot of friends, colleagues, counterparts. You know, I did a lot of quasi interviews. We'd meet for coffee or phone conversations. I talked to people who had started their own firms. I talked to people who had changed careers and then I just took some time to self reflect. There's actually two books, you know, there's a lot of books that I read in the time and I kept a journal while I was, was doing it.

C But one of them was designing your life.

B I always recommend that one.

C Yes, it was fantastic. And then Life Pass is the other that I found really helpful. And the way I looked at it every day in my architecture world, I was helping people kind of design their envision and design their next step, their future. But I never turned it back on myself. And so that's what I was doing. And so I was, you know, you name it, I was idea mapping and interviewing and doing all the things to try to open my mind up to what those possibilities could be. So that was about two months where it was just focused on, you know, taking in ideas and not taking any kind of meetings. And then I slowly said, okay, I'll start to hear what the opportunities are.

C And so I met with everything from architecture firms, construction developers. And I actually, you know, thought very seriously about starting my own firm. You know, I had a Potential partner. And, and we had brainstormed and we both kind of mutually made the decision. When we brainstormed, we. We figured out very quickly that traditional architecture was at the bottom of what we had. You know, the list of the things that we were going to do. And we said, oh, well, maybe we're not starting an architecture firm.

C And so landscape forms opportunity came up and, and as soon as I started the conversation with them and realized, you know, the similarities in, you know, the things that they hold dear, their values, it really got me interested. And the more I met with them, the more I got excited and then I just took the leap.

B So what's interesting to me is you said that you wanted to make a transition, but then when you open things up again, you were very much still, I would say, operating within the AEC sphere. So is there something that happened during those first two months where you're just like, I still need to be adjacent or within the built environment, that kind of limited where you looked for in terms of next steps?

C It did, you know, the things that I'm. I found that I was really passionate about was related to the built environment and the people that are working in the built environment. And so, you know, I still find joy in going to, you know, AIA events. I'm still very involved on that side. And when I go on vacations, you know, while everybody's looking at the scenery, I'm taking pictures of, you know, handrail details.

B And inherently still a part of you.

C Yes, yes, it is very much a part of me. And so, yes, I, you know, I did think that I was going to be adjacent. I wasn't going to close the door to those opportunities that were outside of it. But you also, you also kind of start with what you know, you know, and the people and, you know, and the opportunities that come your way are kind of through that network. But that's why I was. I think I was really intrigued about landscape forms because it's something I hadn't thought of before. One of the other things that I tell other people as I give them advice and that I had to tell myself over and over again is to not put all the pressure on this next decision. You know, I think a lot of people stay where they are and because they're afraid that the decision they're making for their next career step may not be the right one.

C And so I said very quickly this. It may end up not being the right thing, but at the end of the day, I'm going to learn something from this. I'M going to take from these experiences and that's going to feed into the next thing. And I just, you know, I feel really fortunate and I think I got lucky and I. And I did a lot of research that Landscape Forms is the next right decision for me and it has worked out wonderfully. But I think we put so much pressure on ourselves to be, you know, to perfectly walk that line and we're afraid to fail a little bit.

B I think that's important to even give ourselves grace in figuring out what our next steps are in life and knowing that, as you said, it's not necessarily always going to be forward, but it's definitely a learning experience. What was your first point of contact with Landscape Forms? Were you, like, on LinkedIn or indeed, did someone from your network say, have you talked to this company? What was that initial introduction? Or how did you discover Landscape Forms?

C So it actually was a former colleague. So as I, like I said, I was some people reaching out to me, asking me, what are you doing? And I was reaching out to people and saying, tell me more about what you're doing. And I had a former colleague who was at Landscape Forms and said, you know, I think you should. And I was actually talking to them about starting a firm and just advice on those kinds of things. And they said, you know what, you should talk to this company and you should see what's out there for you. And, you know, my initial reaction was, well, what am I going to do at landscape forums? But it was that exact reaction that made me go, you need to have a conversation. This is exactly what you need in your process to think about the possibilities that weren't even on your mind map that you made in your process.

B So you've been on Landscape Forms for almost two years now. The initial offering from Landscape Forms with a director of sales. So some people may get into their head and be like, I was vice president at stantech. How can I go to director of sales at Landscape Form? What was the internal battle, if any, that you faced when you were pondering, like, the title and the actual roles and responsibilities of that next step?

C You know, I would be lying if I said there wasn't maybe a little internal battle with that. But again, I think the value of the time that I took off was me being able to understand what am I fulfilled by. And it's not the titles, it's the work that I'm doing, right? And so, you know, we build this construct in our mind about, well, we should always be taking a step up, you know, up a ladder or whatever it is. But that's not what I was looking for. In fact, that's what I stepped away from. I intentionally stepped away from, from that ladder. If, if I had wanted to work towards the next rung on that ladder, I probably could have. But I knew that wasn't going to bring me the fulfillment that I was looking for.

C And so I tried to take that off the table in all the conversations that I was having. And I think it was easier because I was stepping into a different industry, you know, an adjacent industry, but a different industry. I think it's easier to say it doesn't matter where you step in, just get in and start to learn and then figure out your highest and best use is within that organization. And quite frankly, I was so kind of stunned and excited about my conversations with landscape forms that I just wanted to get in. And I was like, this could be really cool. And imagine the things I could learn. And Director of Sales, you know, a part of what I did in architecture, you know, we're selling our services, right? And a lot of the clients that I had were clients that I held onto for 10 plus years. And then of course, finding new clients.

C And that's exactly what you're doing. You're selling services, you're selling design ideas, you know, you name it, that's a part of the gig.

B What other skills were you able to kind of transition from your position at Santec as you moved into landscape form? So you talk a little bit about sales, but were there other transferable skills that were very apparent to you? And then the flip side is like, why did you find yourself learning and discovering most when you jumped in?

C So there's a lot of skills that translated. In my architecture career, I spent a lot of time on highly complex projects with lots of stakeholders and lots of people and entities involved. And so you learn how to navigate that, how to empower the people that you work with, the teams that you work with, for them to do their best work and to get over or around any obstacles that come in their, in their way, and to stay focused on what the goal is. And in each one of those, you're learning. And I think that's what I loved about education design. One day I could be doing a stadium, the next day I could be doing an ag science center, and then it could be a robotics building. And in every single one of those projects, I came to the table not knowing anything about ag science, you know, and you know that pigs are the most sensitive of all the animals. In an ag barn, and they don't want to be too hot and they don't want to be too cold.

C And you have to learn those things and the functions that need to happen and then apply what, you know, as an architect to that. To work together, you know, to come to a solution. That skill set translates to, to almost anything. I, you know, I, I feel pretty strongly, I will say, when I first came in, you have a little bit of imposter syndrome, right? Because I went from being the person who had most of the answers. You know, I was the person in the room that had most of the answers. And then all of a sudden I was the person who had all the questions and almost no answers. And, and that can be a little bit overwhelming at first, but very quickly I settled in and I realized, okay, I don't know, have the answers for that, but I have my experiences and my skill set for knowing how to navigate these problems and ask the right questions to get us to the right place. And once I kind of had that under my belt, you know, I realized, okay, you know, you're supposed to be here and you are contributing.

B So what do you miss most, if anything, about the role you left in traditional practice?

C Well, you know, it's interesting because I'm really lucky in the timing that I joined Landscape Forms. We are actually expanding our headquarters in Kalamazoo, Michigan. So we're doing a 300,000 square foot manufacturing addition. And guess who's the architect on staff? Right. So I get to flex my architect muscles, but I'm not the architect of record. I get to work with, you know, the architecture and construction teams. And so in some ways, I still very much feel like I'm in that world, but of course, I'm doing all these other things. And so I'm at a place right now where I think I'm.

C I'm still hanging on to those things that were important to me from traditional practice. And of course, I'm still very involved, you know, in TXA and AIA and mentorship. You know, I think that's one of the biggest things. It's always been important to me, and it's carried beyond my traditional practice role. I still have so many mentorship sessions with architects and aspiring architects, and I love that part of, you know, architecture. I had it within, but I realized I wasn't ever doing that on my architecture time. That's just what I do because I love it and I still do it, and I find a lot of joy in that.

B I feel like we need more Individuals like yourself that continue to be engaged and invested even though that you've stepped off of the traditional path. I think it just goes to show how important our voices are in other venues, including being the only architect in a manufacturing company like Landscape Forms and what it means to have your voice within that type of company. And they obviously see the value in it too. So because they've now they've stepped you up to Chief Strategy Officer. So what does that look like? What was the transition from Director of Sales to Chief Strategy Officer?

C Well, it's very much happening right now and it's been great. I think, you know, with Chief Strategy Officer, every day is different and I love that. That's part of what I loved in architecture as well. So there's some similarities there. We rolled out our new three year strategic plan at the beginning of this year and so I'm stepping in and it's my job to support and implement that plan and make sure we're looking for opportunities for growth and fostering that growth, all while still remaining true to our foundations in design, culture, craft and sustainability. Again, those are those words that drew me over to them and so I find so much energy in that. I'm also in charge of a couple key initiatives with the company, one of which is the headquarters expansion which I'm enjoying. Also our work in the K12 market and arena.

C As you can imagine, my work in education, really I'm still passionate about that. I'm still passionate about the learning environment. And one of the things I was really passionate about was outdoor learning, which we realized in Covid how important that is. And so there was a really natural thread from what I was doing to what I'm doing now in landscape forms, in building partnerships and helping us work with owners and landscape architects on what the possibilities are in the outdoor learning environment. The other things I'm working on are overseeing our sustainability, our people department, our lighting segment and also our structure segment. So there's a lot wrapped up in the role, but it's all really exciting. And I think my skill set coming from architecture, where we tackle these big challenging problems and it's not a you tackle it for two months thing, it's a let's look long term and then let's figure out our steps moving towards that goal. Those are things that it's just kind of innate to me.

C And so I'm really enjoying doing that in this role here.

B Absolutely. So you talked about and it's interesting, I feel like people are naturally probably drawn to you as and seek you out. When it comes to career advice, I sometimes find myself in the same ship. But it's also, you know, I say that I've talked people into pursuing their license. I've also talked people into different paths just because I don't want. I believe everyone should follow their passion to the extent that whenever they get up and they're ready to go to work, that they're excited about that. Are you doing kind of the same thing through your mentorship? It's not. It's not just.

B And I just want to make it maybe obviously clear for any listeners who are like, oh, Evelyn and Laura are talking about people, like, convincing people to leave architecture. I don't think that's what we're doing at all. So I would love to get your kind of take on it as well.

C Absolutely. And you're 100% correct on that. I spend more time mentoring people on how to progress in the field of architecture than those looking for something else, because you couldn't have convinced me 10 years ago to step off that path. And I don't regret any moment that I had on that path. But when the time was right for me to look for something else, the time was right. But there's a lot of people who struggle to progress. There's those who don't immediately see the value in their license. So I am.

C You can ask a lot of people who have worked with me in the past. I am one of those. I'd like to say, a motivator for architectural license. Some might say I'm a little pushy, but, you know, those who I know will benefit from that in their career, and it will help them achieve the things they want. I'm 100% a champion for those individuals. And then also, there's a lot of. There's a lot of different paths within traditional practice, and some people get stuck. And if we don't help them find what that exact path is within traditional practice, they might step off when they still have a passion and a really good place for them within it.

C So I love to help them through that as well. So you're right. It's both. You know, I want the profession of architecture to succeed. It is so important. What we bring to this society as architects is a viewpoint that I believe makes the world a better place. Right. We challenge.

C We challenge the norms on some things that are really important. And I've seen architects push some things that have made our communities better.

B I have a question on the other side of that. So I do think I often find myself Personally being criticized for having stepped away, or generally, if they're very good friends, just like, maybe not criticize, but they're like, you know, they're checking in with me to make sure I have my head on straight and I'm about the decisions that I'm making. So what has been the response from your colleagues? I would say both good friends and other acquaintances of where you've landed now that you've been in this role for a bit.

C It's been all over the board. I will say I feel like I have had a better experience than what I've observed for other people who have left the profession. I think I'm really lucky in the timing. When I stepped out to do my sabbatical, that's right when I was starting my AI Houston presidency and also the chair of the TXA Government Affairs Committee. So in that time, I was everywhere doing all the things. I was testifying at the legislature for school safety. And at one point my husband was like, do I need to share with you the definition of sabbatical? Because I don't think you understand what taking a break means. So I, you know, I think I was lucky in that time because.

C And then I was still in those two roles as I transitioned into landscape forms. And so people were very clear by my actions that I am committed to this profession. I'm not walking away from architecture. I'm just changing the way that I interact with it. And I think I can make a positive impact from another chair. I'm not going to lie and say there weren't moments where people I could tell felt threatened by it, felt threatened by my decision, and maybe questioned my commitment to the profession by leaving. But to those people, I just say, well, you know, I'm still here. Look at the things that I work to contribute.

C And that's not being, you know, pompous or showy, but it's just saying I. It's in action. Right. I. I am constantly working towards helping out young architects, architects on the path, working in the profession to do what I can. And so I just kind of have to block out those other viewpoints. Right? Because I think it, to me, it really is someone who's threatened by someone who's done something a little different.

B What maybe top three things do you find yourself often repeating to. To mentees? And there might be different ways to look at this. I imagine you are mentoring individuals that have a variety of different career stages. So I don't know if you want to take this from, like, what do you typically say to early, mid or late career stages, or if there's just generally three things that you often find yourself repeating in these mentorship sessions, kind of as takeaways to our audience.

C I'll start with the mentee. You know, the mentees, the young, I should say. I'll say that differently. I'll start with those that are stepping into architecture. Right. So whether they're in school still. So I actually had a session with a young lady a couple of weeks ago who's still in college, and she got my name, and so we spent some time, and she's giving me updates on where she's going for an internship and to that set of people I really focus on. Get all the exposure that you can, learn as much as you can, and don't be afraid to try whatever gets thrown at you.

C You know, I remember coming in on my first day as an intern and not knowing what that line and dot meant on that detail. Right. And I knew it was really important, but I didn't know what that was. But not shying away from that and being willing to do anything, you know, any challenge that they put ahead of me and to get different experiences. So that's what I tell them. Mid to later in career, the things I have started to talk about is to not feel like a successful career has to be one linear path. That's what I was taught in school, and that's the messaging that you hear that a successful architectural career is one that goes down this path. You get into a firm, you intern, you work your way up in that firm, maybe you start your own firm, or you work your way up towards a principal of a firm.

C And the reality is that's not the path for everyone. And you could do that path, and then there may be a next phase to your career, and then there could be a phase after that. And so I always say to look for the build or the evolution of your career. And what I mean by the build is how are you building off of the experiences that you have garnered in the time that you've been on your path? And how can those experiences help you build towards your next evolution, whatever that is? It could still be on the traditional path. It could be something else. And I think a lot of us sometimes hang on too long to the things, the initiatives that we start. And I think this is important not just for architecture, but any profession. We should be empowering those, you know, that are coming up behind us to, you know, sometimes they're taking on what we've started, but empowering them to make it their own, because they're going to bring a different perspective to it that's going to make it more successful probably than we ever even imagined.

C A lot of people spend their whole career hanging on to this one thing. And I think innovation happens when we step out of our comfort zone and we let somebody else, you know, step into maybe what we've started, but they let them take it from there. And that last thing is, you know, again, not being afraid to step into your uncomfort zone. That's what I call it. You know, instead of setting. Stepping out of your comfort zone, you're stepping into your uncomfort zone. And I think that's where real, meaningful change happens for yourself and for those around you. And so wherever you are, once you've kind of gotten that foundation, you've been in the business for a little bit and you feel like you've garnered some knowledge, then look for the evolution.

B Yeah, I think we often forget, and I even say this of myself, so I was a college athlete, and I love playing in the rain and snow. And as I've gotten older, I'm less excited to play in the rain and the snow. But it's just like as I've gotten older, my ability to flex and to be uncomfortable and my tolerance around that change has, you know, even in terms of the time I want to spend outdoors has evolved. And I have to constantly remind myself that it is in those uncomfortable moments that we tend to have the most growth. So I think that's important.

C Absolutely. Yeah. And, you know, if I. If I look back at my. The 20 years in traditional practice, the highlights, you know, the biggest moments for me are those where I truly stepped into a world that I felt out of place in, you know, or out of out of my element. I won't say out of place, you know, but, you know, resilience. When we had Hurricane Harvey in Houston, which, you know, caused $125 billion worth of damage to the Gulf coast area, I wasn't an expert on resilience, but I was an expert on living in a community where flood and all and storms were a reality. And so I put my hand up and said, I think we as in the we with stantec, because again, Stantec is a large multidisciplinary firm with lots of expertise.

C And I was like, we need to be in this conversation. And of course, if you're the one that put your hands up, you're the one that leads, you know, leads that charge. And so I did. And it. I didn't have to be the expert, but I learned and I pulled in all the experts and put together, you know, a workshop with, you know, 50 participants to come up with meaningful ideas and action plans that, that we could work towards in Houston. And that was huge. And had I not had I just said, well, I don't know anything about resilience, then none of that would have happened, you know. So I use moments like that as a reminder that don't be afraid of what you don't know, be willing to learn what you don't know.

C But that's where your perspective is going to be meaningful because you're going to bring something new to that conversation.

B What is your hope for the future of architects? Architects voice in the community, architectural practice. If you were to continue to follow your passionate route and have a bigger voice, what does that future of architects look like in that world?

C That's a big one for me. My vision for architecture and something that I still am working towards and trying to be helpful from where I am now is for our society and our communities to understand the value of architects. I think in general, architects tend to be risk averse. And in that, very slowly, you know, we're seeing other people step into our realm and driving the decisions that get made, whether that's at the community level or the state or the national level. And so it's so incredibly important for architects to be in the conversations, to have a voice. And I think the more we do that, the more the public will understand the perspective that we bring, that we're not just people who are drawing buildings, drawing pretty pictures and it gets built, that there's actually a thought process where we can positively impact the environment around us. And that's from the building level to much larger. Right.

C But I think if you ask the average person if the design of a building impacts them, they probably wouldn't understand that it actually does, that it impacts the way they feel, the way they interact and all of those things. And we're trained to think about all those things. And so translating that value to the public is I think, the number one. And I think other things will fall in place after that.

A Hi Disruptors, thank you for joining us today on an episode of Practice Disrupted. If you like the content for today's show, you can find all of our past episodes over on practiceofarchitecture.com podcast. Be a part of the conversation by joining me, our speakers and other disruptors in our community@practiceofarchitecture.com community. Our social media handle is practiceofarch. That's practiceofarch. We'd love to hear from you, so feel free to drop us a DM and say hello. Tune in next week for a new conversation on change in the profession.