Architecture, And: Social Impact

A Hi. It's Demetrius. Hey, Demetrius. It's Mark. They're in.

B Nice. Taking it to the next level.

A Launching phase 2 of cable media on October 70.

C I'm Evelyn Lee. And I'm Janine Chastain. We're collaborating on curated conversations to explore how the industry is changing.

D Together, we'll find ways to create new solutions to current challenges while elevating the value of architects.

C Welcome to Practice Disrupted.

D Hello, listeners. Welcome back to Practice Disrupted. Hi, Janine.

C Hey, Evelyn, and welcome back, listeners.

D Janine, you were first introduced to our next guest at the Young Architect Conference earlier this summer. He's also been on a few podcasts. Tell us a little bit about What specifically interested you in bringing him on and having him share his story on Practice Disrupted?

C So I I first heard Juan Daley speak about managing his personal mental health at the summer series, and I knew he was Friends with a bunch of former AIS officers, so we had some mutual friends in common. And I went back and listened to his episode on the YoungArcheteq podcast, And he has such a compelling story to share about his journey from growing up to going to college and Setting out to go down a career direction that he's gonna tell us about today. However, you know, he's doing a lot of interviews right now, and I wanna be respectful that, there are a lot of interviews out there that set that story up, and I highly recommend them to our listeners, But we're gonna focus on a different direction on Wunde Dilly's story and that's on his entrepreneurship journey. This interview is gonna focus on his journey into social entrepreneurship. Social entrepreneurship is actually A growing interest, I would say. I think even in my time in business school, if I

D think about the classes I took, You know, TOMS shoes was one of the 1st case studies that comes to mind that is trending in a lot of business schools. The notion That from the beginning, they were going to give a pair of shoes for every single one sold. So buy 1, give 1. For me, I've really seen the growth of businesses that are in the business of serving the global community by using business as a force for good To steal from the b Lab slogan. And as of this podcast, there are actually over 3,500 certified b corporations in A 150 different industries in 74 counties. And for those of you who don't know what that is, a certified B Corp is a new kind of business that balances purpose and profit. So it's a type of corporation, not dissimilar like from C Corp, S Corps, Or being an LLC. So they are legally required to consider the impact of their decisions on their workers, customers, suppliers, community, and the environment.

D So this is a community of leaders driving a global movement of people using business as a force for good. So if you Think about b corps that you might know today, they include brands like Ben and Jerry's, Allbirds, Clean, Canteen, Patagonia, Athleta. And there are a lot more companies that are really out there trying to do good in business While also being profitable.

C So coming out of school, I ended up going to work with a bunch of different nonprofits In architecture and that got me into that social do good world of architecture including volunteering with for humanity who was a huge inspiration for me during my undergraduate studies, and I was inspired by that Idea of social impact and social impact justice approach towards architecture. When I Went for my MBA, I pursued a concentration in social entrepreneurship. And so social impact or social justice Design or any of those terms that you wanna call it, it you know, it's also previously known as socially responsible business. It's a lens through which essentially I studied all my business classes, so including econ, finance, marketing, and so on. So social entrepreneurship is about building and maybe really at its core, running a business with a priority towards ethical leadership and decision making. And companies that tend to fall into this category are businesses that prioritize people, community, perhaps The environment, diversity and inclusion, and more, and so obviously, I thought coming from architecture it was a really natural Bridge into the world that I had already studied. And so Juan Dealey, who's our guest today, he defines social entrepreneurship as impact first And profit second. So a little bit more about our speaker.

D Wandili Metiani grew up in South Africa at a time when his community was 1st navigating a post apartheid existence. Apartheid was a system of institutionalized racial segregation that existed in South Africa and Southwest Africa From 1948 until the early 19 nineties, he observed that a lack of dignified housing from apartheid architecture impacted his community. His career has been inspired by his drive to solve affordable housing. His local municipality afforded him an opportunity To study at Andrews University located in Michigan. He was finally able to meet like minded peers and make his lifelong dream a reality. With this urgency and desire to help his South African community, Juan Dealey found opportunities to learn from his professors and classmates about engaging his passion for architecture, While using these skills as a tool to empower shantytowns back home, this was the birth of Unpun Design Group. He He was 25 years old when he was selected from a pool of over 21,000 applicants to become an Obama fellow. The Obama Leadership Program is focused on leadership development and civic engagement.

D Janine, why don't you tell us a little bit more about his company?

C Sure. So Ubuntu means I am because we are. An Ubuntu Design Group is an organization that focuses on social impact design projects ranging from individual housing to urban design scale. Influenced by his childhood experiences growing up in a post Apartheid South Africa. Juan Dealey founded UDG on the core idea that if apartheid architecture could be used to segregate and oppress, The community led design should liberate and enable opportunities for all. UDG developed the concept of the Ubuntu Home, A dignified work live home designed to enable the families to financially sustain themselves as well as to empower the local community. Wandili is also the founder and director of the Ubuntu Architecture Summer Abroad Program, an intercollegiate educational experience in which Students learn a community centered approach to impacting large communities by designing and building dignified and culturally influenced housing for resilient families. In 2017, UDG built their pilot project which was a home for a low income Durban based family Also struggling to live in their current dwelling with a disability.

C This inspired the designers of UDG to develop their unique model in a way that would facilitate Future projects with more public and private companies. The power of this model is in the transformative programs that would make Quality housing more accessible by providing micro mortgages for entrepreneurial low income families. The project was a finalist at the South by Southwest Eco Place by Design competition and won the Student Grand Prize Award By the Congress for New Urbanism for Best Urban Design. Ubuntu's approach won the Resolution Project Social Venture Challenge in 2015 at 1 Young World's Global Youth Leadership Summit and through the World Merit Platform. The concept was presented at the United Nations headquarters in New York.

D Great. Let's cut to the interview.

C Have you always known that you wanted to be an entrepreneur, Or was that something that you discovered along the way?

B I think I've always known that I wanted to be an entrepreneur. It's Crazy. I remember, you know, growing up in an informal settlement in Southern Africa. There was this, like, cult, where these folks would worship, like, they would use, like, white rocks, around the tree, and that's like that's where they would worship. It's called the shambi. Right. And, basically, what I would do is, I'd go find these rocks and sell it Today to make money. And then sometimes, I could still have a night and sound them again in the morning today.

B That was terrible. But but from there, I was like 6, selling these rocks. And then from there, I started, like, I would go to, like, the local supermarket. You know how, like, when you just finish buying stuff, And then you have a couple of coins with, your receipt. Mhmm. And, like, a lot of people just, like, throw that on the floor by accident, or you just don't care. You know what I mean? So I picked up all of those coins, got to 5 brands. I bought sweets, which were a 100 sweets, and I was able to to make, like, a 100% profit from selling those sweets to kids.

B I may have gotten chased out of Sunday school a few times, and And school, like, real school because I wasn't supposed to be selling stuff at school. So I've just always been doing these crazy entrepreneurial ventures, growing up.

D That's like a whole another level of entrepreneurism because I think not everyone has that level of hustle, Especially at that age.

B You gotta hustle to survive, baby. There it is.

C That's true. And, Evelyn, I don't know if you heard this story. I I don't wanna Repeat it too much because, I wanna save it for people to go listen to the full episode, but they talked about him. He knew he was gonna go to college, and he needed funding for that 1st year to to pay for college. And so he Went to was it it was your government building. Was it a mayor or a

B Yeah. Durban mayor.

C The Durban mayor, he showed up every day To talk to them to see if they would sponsor him or the if they would work with him, and he was ultimately really successful because he convinced the mayor And, you know, a chance encounter as the mayor was coming in the door to talk to him about the work that he wanted to do for his community, and that was what helped him. And then later, he he continued to go back and try and figure out, like, how to keep funding school year to year, which To me, it speaks to someone who is really savvy and is thinking about, like, how to, you know, take risks, Secure funds and and funnel that into the work that you're trying to create in the world. So I wanted to, transition into talking about the Ubuntu Design Group, which is the company that you started. And I wanted to ask you More about what you're doing and some of the unique things that you're working on.

B Yes. And maybe even before I touch on that, just to Maybe close out some of the discussion we were having about sort of hustle and where that comes from. I think when you grow up in a low income community, That's a disadvantaged community, not necessarily by choice, but by history, In the case of South Africa and even the United States with our partner architecture, pushing certain groups of people to particular neighborhoods and avoiding them of opportunities, both economically and socially, which results in lower income, Higher crime rates, no, jobs, etcetera. So what what's ends up happening is like, you you grew up with a certain level of like, Resilience because it's like, well, we're on our own. And, you know, everything that we need to do, is the stuff that we need to do to survive and and and make it through. Right? There's also this perception that no one else cares, about that particular situation, because no one is doing actively doing anything to change that situation. And I would assume, Folks growing up in places like the South Side of Chicago may have, a similar mentality. So then You can look at that in 2 ways, where it's like, oh, well, we're screwed, and then, you know, there's nothing I can do.

B Or it's like, okay, how can we fight to get put out? You know? How can we fight to sort of Make the most out of the situation, and be able to sort of come up. And I think a defining element For me, in all of this is wasn't just about how do you then fight or work or creatively innovate to be able to sort of Make it out. It's like, how do you creatively innovate to make it out so that you can build a bridge for everyone else, to be able to come up. And I think I said this in a few different podcasts where I'm saying that, like, in the west, there's this notion that, you know, People in low income communities are uncreative, or nazy, or any of the things. But The truth is the opposite, because it's folks who are on those blue collar workers who build our skyscrapers, who build our stadium, To build our homes, they just don't have the same level of finances to finance those buildings for themselves. And, you know, folks who are able to build a house out of anything, that's how you have shanty cover. It is informal settlement. That just goes to show the level of creativity and ingenuity that exists.

B And, you know, growing up learning and and seeing all of that really inspired me to want to do architecture so that I could be able to maybe have a platform to highlight some of that creativity and ingenuity, but also to learn some of those key structural elements and things within architecture to partner that with the local engineers to build sustainable, safe, culturally contextual Homes and communities and spaces and places that are inclusive and equitable, for all, and that's what Ubuntu Design Group Exists to do, and that's what the open architecture somehow abroad as well, works towards.

C Yeah. I'm glad you I'm really glad that you shared that because I think that really is important to your narrative and the story that You had this greater vision and that's kind of what has propelled you into entrepreneurship and creating this business. So how long have you been running your design studio for?

B So, well, I started in college, in 2015. And basically throughout College, when I was learning architecture, it was very neurocentric architecture and a lot of building that We were assigned to do, or the ones we were learning about, I never saw myself even walking into them or living And then yeah. I mean and I never saw my my community, you know, even having the privilege to see those type of buildings. Right?

C Right.

B So I always, you know, push back on professors in the context of, you know, you guys are always talking about, like, you know, when you do social impact, whatever, but that's not reflected on on the designs that you you you assign us to do. Right? Like, on the on the education we're learning. So as a form of protest, but also as me living up to why I came to study art class in America, I started to go to the language With that fundamental premise that, what about the other 90% of the world, right, that's don't afford our expensive buildings. And that's how open to design, it's such a designing. For me, housing has always been personal This is because of where I came from, like, how do we solve affordable housing? So it's like a designing this open to home model where it's a home with a commercial component. And the idea that like a house doesn't take you out of poverty, but a commercial opportunity does create economic opportunities for yourself, for you to be able to maintain that housing, but also for you to impact the rest of the community. So each home that we've built has that component. We designed and built a pilot home in collaboration with Andrews University.

B And the family, we we built it for some child families Enobobolo, they live with disabilities, and they've lost their, mud back home due to a light rainstorm. We worked with them and the community and these are hundreds of built. A home, now they're living in a dignified home. The lady, Missus and Charlie had worked at a daycare for 10 years. And now she's running a daycare that attached to their home. We built the daycare for 6 kids, they've got 18 kids. They've over tripled their income. They're now taking the profit from that daycare.

B They're building a whole new facility. 18 mothers cannot go to work if they send their kids to school. It's like, could could a house be more than just a place to sleep in? Could it be a place that enables calmness, enables opportunity, enables education? And that's Some of the things that we've been looking at when we're working on such, work in progress.

D When I think about the people that are graduating Right now, I think like a lot of people gravitate towards the type of work that you're doing and And would love to be a part of that. I guess my my question is, how how do you support Yourself, how do you support your staff? Is it through partners? You know, how how do I how do I do that type of meaningful Work and, you know, and still feed myself.

B That's a that's a that I think that's a very good question, that's we're also still trying to figure out. But I would say, you know, at the very least, The 1st step that I'm taking is to normalize that type of work. You know what I mean? It's normalized now. So there's a couple of things that we're doing and Figuring out on that regard. So one of them is we're working on this micro mortgage model. And we've been building this for like the past 2 years now, where we design and build homes for low income entrepreneurial families, who are lend owning, build a home, and it has a commercial space. And then they're able to not only financially financially sustain themselves, they're also able to to Pay off the micro mortgage, towards that home. So what that does is it enables us to scale the model, but also it enables us to pay it forward and make it sustainable.

B So we're working on that, and we're having conversations with different local banks, and trying to figure out how do we I think one of the biggest Factors or issues we've came across is just like the cost of construction being a little more expensive. How do we then Value engineered that down whilst keeping dignity. You know what I mean? So there's those elements that we're currently working on, but also, outside of the home model, we are just a social impact architecture firm. So we work with organizations that are trying to have social impact in communities. Like we're defining A daycare for a a township in South Africa right now. We're working on designing a a school For kids with autism in Angola, so it's through those sort of design projects that we are able to sort of make money as we, creates interesting models and test them out to hopefully create a future where inclusive architecture is the norm. You know what I mean? But then also for people who are interested in getting into this type of work, and being a part of innovating an architecture that serves the other 90%. You know, that's how that's why we started the Open TO Architecture Summer abroad, which we're going to talk about in more depth.

D That's a good segue. So you created a summer program for students to come to South Africa and learn about your community. Why don't you go ahead and tell us a little bit more about that?

B Yeah. Because, look, when I went to architecture school, in Michigan, When we were being taught about, like, architecture history, I remember, you know, I was excited because I saw, like, on the class that's, You know, the 1st chapters, we will be learning about, like, Egypt and Mesopotamia and stuff like that. I was like, Amin, or African architecture. It said African architecture. And then, you know, we got there with started learning. But there was, like, practically, like, 22 pages of Egyptian architecture. And the interesting thing is that, like, within those 10 to 2 pages, it said, And this was the bedrock of what we now know as, you know, Greece or Roman architecture, which led to the Renaissance, which led to where we're at today, Right? So like the invention of the columns, the colonnades, the orders, all these things All came from African architecture or Egyptian architecture. And then we spent the Rest of the 700 page book, learning about Renaissance, Baroque, you know, and all that stuff.

B Right? So my my thing was, like, number 1, there's a lot more to Africa than just Egypt because I wasn't from Egypt. And I, Yeah. And then number 2, it's like it's made me disconnect from architecture because I felt like Maybe architecture wasn't for people from my community, or people like me, or people you know what I mean? Apparently, we didn't have anything to contribute to the architecture world. And, you know, I think that has like, you know, significant impact on, on, on architects. And I think, I'm Pei says a very interesting quote on on on this. It says architecture is the very mirror of life. You only have to cast your eyes on buildings to feel the presence of the past, the spirits of a place. They are the reflection of society.

B Yo. That that's you know, when I when I read that, it's it's encapsulates exactly how I felt. Like, The architecture that we're teaching is a reflection of society. Right? So I know there's a lot of with, you know, Black Lives Matter, Police brutality and all these things, and everyone is like, oh, man, these cops are doing this, blah, blah, blah. But the bigger question is, This is not a cop's problem. It's bigger than that. Right? Like, in order for these cops to be in these neighborhoods, someone had to design them. Back in 1950s, 1960s, it's us who were at the roots of creating this systemic problem.

B We designed segregated neighborhoods, which resulted to Levittown in south side of Chicago, and, you know, apartheid architecture in South Africa. And then what that It was the these places were devoid of economic of economic opportunities, good education, which led to higher dropouts rates, higher unemployment, which directly, scientifically correlates to higher crime rates due to scarcity and higher crime rates then justifies higher policing by the government in these areas. And then the higher policing then leads to what? Police brutality in African American neighborhoods. So what this program is doing is educating The next generation of socially inclined architects to design more equitable, inclusive Spaces that allow opportunities for all. And the 1st place to start with that is educating, these young architects about the role that architecture has played and continues to play in social justice, right? But it's not enough to just point out what the problem is. They also get to be a part of designing and building a home For a family that was negatively affected by these very same exclusionary architectural practices, which were done in apartheid architecture. And I think one of the the key towards this program was, I wanted to strip away people from They are emotions that they're attached to their context and environments, and the politics, and everything, that's clouds, sort of the narrative around social justice, and help them learn about this in a very totally different context, which is South Africa, And then about African architecture, how Apartheid architecture affected people, and how they are now being a part of the solution of that, And hopefully take those principles back to Brooklyn, Chicago, Michigan, and wherever they're from, and start designing more inclusive and And, equitable spaces.

C Can you tell us more about the community? And also, To your point, if if we're re educating architects, especially American architects on what African architecture means, What do you want people to know about African architecture? What's the most important thing that they should understand?

B I'd say I think we need to start by saying, the fact that there is something called African architecture, right? There's a lot of creativity and ingenuity that exists and that has come out of African architecture, which has been the bedrock of the architecture that we're designing today. So essentially, what we're doing is taking people back to the source, and helping them realize where all of this is coming from, and and what it all needs. And what that does is not just in a, sort of, you know, those short term missions, This type of programs, but in a very immersive, and been a mutually beneficial, arrangement, Where at the end, a family has a dignified place to call home. And then at the end, these learners get to know a lot about South African history, South African architecture, and bottom down architecture where they can learn from these communities. And I think one of the important things that happened when we when we did this program with Andrews, is that we started seeing how people's mindsets were shifting on architecture. I remember this girl coming up to me, like, man, I didn't know architecture could save lives and have so much impact. I thought it was just all about Walkable streets in San Francisco, infinity pools, and and all this stuff. So it's been a very life changing experience To learn from these communities and their resilience and their ingenuity and how they do things, and to help these young American Students to realize there's more to the world of architecture, than just what we are learning.

B Right? And then then their own context. And what this does is it starts enabling these young architects to design for more than just their own cultures, For me more than just the old self, to be more inclusive and to to think about others as well.

D I wanted to offer an opportunity For you to to promote the program. So is it is it just open to Andrew's students? Like, if I'm a young architect or if I'm a a student Right now, how, you know, is there opportunities for me to get involved? How many cohorts do you guys have? What does that look like?

B Yeah. No. That's the exciting part. So it is open to everyone regardless of the school that you go to. So that's exciting. And people can take it as an independent study or an elective, contingent that your school, agrees. We will send them a curriculum, and we would have a conversation Or you could just take it as independently, as an individual. So our application deadline is on the 30th October.

B But another exciting part of the program is that we are working to have different partners. So like, for example, Michael Risuke and the Young Architects I'm sponsoring a student, and so they have a law young architects scholarship. So different architecture firms or even individuals Can be able to contribute towards, having an s scholarship for for students to come and learn about this equitable type of architecture and these different levels, And they can see it all on the open architecture summer abroad website, and each scholarships creates a scholarship after your name or that particular Architecture firm's name or whatever they would like it to be called. So it's really exciting, and we've created the scholarship program Because, again, we want it to be as accessible, as possible to to to everyone. We have a cohort of 30, So, space is limited. Yeah.

C And you're going online, I noticed. I was wondering about that because when we first started talking, you I think you were probably trying to figure that out, but it looks like you guys have decided it's gonna be a virtual cohort.

B Yeah. As it stands right now, we are going virtual, which is also exciting and new challenge. But what that means is everything is still the same because The program starts in the spring and ends at the beginning of the summer. Right? And the construction of the house happened in between. We want We want students and or participants to be able to learn the design whilst also learning the local construction methods there, so that that's kind of comes together. We're going to still have those interactive conversations with the contractors, the builders, the family, the community, etcetera, virtually. And the reason behind that is because a lot of schools have very firm statements around, traveling, right now, so it's just like they can't take any course that has travel on it, so that's why we're doing that. However, Individually, if you still want to come, independent of your school, then we'll make arrangements.

B But, yes, we have gone virtual.

C That's great. And, I I mean, I think it's really cool. Would you accept a non student participant if someone who's practicing wants to participate, because I think there might be some people that would be interested.

B Oh, definitely. We definitely, we would be. We're looking at Young professionals and, some architecture students prefer really from 3rd year up. So it's going to be an interesting mix. And another thing that happened, which is really cool, recently, I became friends with, Incorsi, Which is, the closest word to that is the the term king of the region where, Beyonce shot black as king, Oh, yeah. Madal. Yeah. Yeah.

B So he's going to come in and teach us a little bit about the Zulu tradition and Zulu architecture, which has gained to sort of says that's that's gonna be really exciting. Yeah. I'm excited about that.

D That's awesome. Yeah.

C Can you give us an example of a project that you might have in mind so that the listeners can understand, like, what what would they expect In terms of participating.

B Yeah. So, we're we're doing housing, affordable housing for, You know, a family, the the family that we'll be designing and and and and building for is in a community called Umumabulu, and each home We'll have a commercial space, and, it's it's a matter of learning about that particular place, the context, that Family's needs and how they live on a day by day, and how do we then design something that fits that, but also, Works within the budget constraints and the local so all you know, navigating all of these things is going to be really, fun and key, and that's what the program will be about.

C I'm glad you brought up the idea of learning about local building materials and local building, Like historic building methods. When we did that episode with Ilya, he also mentioned that for the communities that he works with. And I think it's really important, you know, I think a lot of this work with social impact justice work, when you go into a community There's a balance where if you're bringing skill set into a community, and especially if you're coming from America, like, you have to be open. This is not a one way relationship. This is about learning about the community, learning about what's important to them. And You're bringing skill set, but more importantly, it's a, two way relationship where the community is also helping design the project. They're also helping to inform what the final product is. And I think what I'm hearing and what you're saying is This program really is rooted in helping people understand the history and the cultural implications of the architecture there locally.

C And so I think it's a great opportunity for someone to kind of immerse themselves And understand a different perspective in the world.

B Yeah. No. Definitely very exciting one. And, you know, when we ran it the 1st time, it's just like some students started crying when they, when they realized some of the impact All of this has, also when you just learn about the people. And, again, I think it's easy for us to dismiss people As, lazy or bombs or this or that because we don't know them. But now, you get to work with them and know them and and realize how amazing and And creative and and all this stuff. And so it's just, like, it's it's beautiful.

C Yeah. I love that. I love that.

D Before we move away from the Avanti group, because there's a there's a few other things from your story that we would really love to touch upon.

B Let's go. Let's go.

D What lessons what lessons can you share for, as a young entrepreneur, to pass along to other aspiring entrepreneurs? Specifically, You know, something that they should do, and then maybe something that they shouldn't do. Or something that Inevitably, you might have made things harder than it needed to be along your journey.

B It's a good question. I think a couple of things. Number 1, sacrifice. Right? So you can't be an entrepreneur and want to succeed and have impact, blah blah blah, And still want to live a normal life as your friends are working nights 5. Your life is going to definitely be a little more stressful, a little more crazy and a little more, less structured as they are. So I think number 1, you you just need to be be ready to sacrifice and hustle. And then number 2 is you're going to come to the end of the road a lot. Like, there's a couple, there's With a couple of times every year around January, I hit a point where I'm like, Oh, what am I doing? Why am I still here? You know, like you question yourself a lot.

B And the only thing that's makes you get past That is like the why. So you gotta have a strong why on why you're doing that. And from what I found, Just making money isn't enough. Why? To keep you through the hard times. Because you could still make some money, you know, By leaving, that's a good to do something more conventional. Fail a lot and fail forward. And, again, that's how you get to what you think is the end point. For example, we were talking to this bank before COVID COVID, and everything was going well about the micro mortgage, and everything was about to sort of come together.

B And then it's like, over 1 week, everything fell apart. Like, our lawyers dropped us. The bank, You know, kind of backed out and everything. And then I was like, that's like the end of the world for me, for a little bit there. Then I was like, after 2 weeks of recovering, I came back, and now we're doing more different exciting stuff. You know? So you constantly need to bet on yourself. Right? You gotta bet on yourself. It's like, well, okay.

B That didn't work out. Let's keep going. But more than that, Something that's really helped me. When I started Ubuntu, I competed at a program called 1 year world, and I won a, business venture competition. And, from there, I got mentors, business mentors from like Wall Street, Harvard School of Business, and, You know, Canada, and, it's through a program called the Resolution Project. Definitely check it out if you're still an undergrad. They have been amazing. So whenever I reach all these points, I can always, like, pick up the call and and call a CEO.

B It was like, I don't know. I tried everything. I did everything right. I never did. It's always helps to have people that are rooting for you. Mhmm. And, it's hard it's hard for me and for other entrepreneurs to step back and and smell the roses and see how much impact you've been able to make and how far you've Come, but they always remind you of that. And also it's like, okay, so this didn't work out.

B So what do we do from here? And that that perspective sounds like very low, but it's means so much because it's like, Oh, I'm not alone. Like, there's people believing me, who are with me in this process, who are there to help me and provide resources and network, etcetera. So man, mentorship is everything, in this process.

D I mean, it's interesting because when I hear people talking about Wanting to start their own anything really, whether they're a young architect, whether they're even mid career professional, You know, they're like, I want control of my schedule. This is why I'm going off on my own. And what they don't realize is that You do have more control of your time, but

B But you have the fight.

D Might be working twice as much 2, because everything that you weren't doing at your 9 to 5 that was helping that 9 to 5 thrive, Like, now you're doing everything.

B Yeah.

C So I I

D think that's that's just like a a cautious reminder of, like, What it takes to kind of step into that role of of an entrepreneur?

B I think one of my friends always says, new levels, new devils. Right? Like, every ecstasy you get to just know there's, like, new challenges that come with it. Because, you know, at one point, I was frustrated by, yeah, a couple of interns, whether it's be performance or coming in late to this or that. I was like, yo. I don't get it. Like, these cats are coming in late. I still have to do all this work, but I still have to, like, you know, talk to them about these things, but this and this. And it's like, yo, remember when you had it at a night to 5, you didn't have to think about that.

B You just did your old little thing, and you passed it along, and you didn't care where it went. Someone had to figure that out to make sure the team is working well and and stuff like that. But, you know, so those are some of the things that's A part of it, but also just like it forces you to grow so much from interpersonal relationships, So learning about finance, to think quick on your fit, and being able to, be able to best present yourself in your work, etcetera.

C I'm glad you brought that up because I have also been feeling over the course of becoming a full time entrepreneur That maybe I was made a little too harsh sometimes on looking at the people that were running my companies, you know, not realizing how far stretched thin they were, and like you say, wanting more of their time. And then not realizing behind the scenes that Just because they go home doesn't mean they stop thinking about their work. It means they went home and they took a dinner break and they're probably still thinking about The problems that

B they're working

C on are they're working on the finance, and you just don't see it. So having limited capacity and Spending a lot more time diving into the weeds on things.

B You are the end of the buck. You know what I mean? Like, whether you're on vacation or whatever, you get a car. It's like, the structure isn't working. You need to drop everything and try to figure it out. Also, your whole vacation is messed up.

C That's true.

B Because now you can't stop thinking about that. You know? It's, Yeah.

C It's a it's a good point. And when do you know because one of the things I struggle with is sometimes I don't know when to Stop and go ask for advice because I will feel like, well, if I just keep working on it, I'll figure this out. So do you have a Way of knowing when you reach the point where you need to, like, just stop and go talk to your mentors.

B You're right. Like, I definitely have struggled with that. But lately, over the past 2 months, I've been growing and focusing on mental health and and stuff like that. And one of the things that have happened is I'm learning to believe in myself the same way I believe and trust in others. You know what I mean? Like, For a long time, I didn't have that trust for myself. I didn't bet on myself like that. So for example, If I reach out to you, I'm like, hey, can I be on your podcast? Before I reach out, in my mind, I was like, oh, what is she going to think? Is it like, You know, am I coming across as, like, using her or needy or this or that? You know what I mean? Like, you think the worst of yourself, Like, at the worst of what the person is going to receive. Now I still have those thoughts, and then I think to myself like, well, is that who I am? Look.

B No. Okay. I'm going to ask her then. How she receives it? It's on her. You know what I mean? So now, I I don't know. I think I'm starting to grow and learn that, like, I need to to love and trust myself As much as I love and trust other people, and I think that's health.

C That's a really good point. I I'm glad you shared

D that. Did did you is there anything else to that you wanted to say relative to the your design group work just before we go we transition away from that?

B So okay. One last thing. A big part of our work we have a few clients, right, like, very few, like, maybe 3. And a big part of our work is trying to figure out gaps and, fill them. Because a lot of the clients you get are the type of work that we don't wanna do, and then the work that you do wanna do, which is a lot of social impact is like, There's no clients for it. So we help people realize their problems. Like right now, Trevor Noah, who I'm a huge fan of, He is doing a partner with Bill Gates and Microsoft to provide computers to schools in, low income communities in South Africa so having grown up in these communities, I know that a lot of these schools don't have computer labs, like rooms to to store this. So what we've done is we've designed a container.

B We call it the smart container lab. So essentially, it's a computer container lab made out of shipping container, outfitted for that, and 100% powered by solar, so it's sustainable. And then we pitch it to them. Right? It's like, I guess this Comes fully fitted everything. It's cost us much. We'd like to work with you and help you scale your receipts. It's amazing. So that's kinda how we are doing things and Trying.

B It doesn't always work, but, definitely, exciting stuff come out of that.

D That's another key to the to entrepreneurship. Right? Like, Figuring out where those gaps are and then pride like, providing solutions. So you constantly speak to your creativity, and I think that's just like another Another way that you've expressed it.

C Yeah. It was interesting to hear you say that you have self doubt because When I heard about your story and I learned about you, what I observed is you seem like someone who's really comfortable with taking risk And you've progressively sought out these opportunities to lead, to do things that are a little bit outside of the box and doing something More challenging for yourself. And so I see you as a risk taker. So, you know, for example, like, where you are now, you were just selected as One of 200 rising leaders to be part of the 2nd cohort of the Obama Foundation leaders as part of their Africa program. And, I mean, that's just one example that you've done a bunch of other things too, including you were a TEDx Johannesburg Fellow. You mentioned the Resolution Project and the one Young world. And I know you came from AAS. So why don't we start with you telling us about the Obama Foundation role And, I guess the question is also like, what makes you so confident? Or what helps you take those risks and stepping into those leadership roles.

B I think the key is to to build mechanisms around doubts. Right? So, here's a funny story that since I've become, Edobaba leader and some other Crazy things have happened since then, which led me to meeting Obama and all the stuff. So it's crazy, but we'll get that submitted to, later. But since I've, done that, a doubts mechanism when I feel scared of something is like Like, I know Obama. What's funny is that, like, even when I talk to my friends, how come I'm trying do this, but I don't know. They will text me, like, you know about

C You're fine. You got this.

B Oh my god. I do. Then it's fine. Yeah. So it's creating sometimes it's something as silly as that. Right? So this creating these mechanisms in your mind because it's all your mind. Before Obama, it was, I've been through worse in life. You know what I mean? Like, I have nothing to lose.

B Like, if if I don't make the cuts Out of 200,000 applicants applying for the Obama Leaders program, then I'm not going to die. You know what I mean? It's like, I just go back to being me, and, you know, I wasn't, like, I wasn't necessarily a high update anyways. Just go back to to your lower self. So, you know, those mental games I play with myself have been very helpful in, Helping me take those risks and and try out stuff. And, you know, every time I like, I I got rejected from The Nelson Mandela Washington Fellowship. And then the week after, I got accepted to the Obama, Leaders Program. And I think to myself, like, ah, man, my people rejected me. Aw.

B But Obama got my back. You know? So there was that. And then Faith, you know, like, I I believe in God and stuff like that. So I was like, well, you know, if God wants me to to be in this position, it's going to happen. So something crazy happens. So I became part of the Obama Leaders Program. We went to, we had the the cohort meeting in Johannesburg. I remember walking in, and, my roommate was from, an island in Africa I had never heard of.

B And I start talking to him, and he's like, oh, yeah, man. I run, a $5,000,000 company. I work with Google, and this, this, this, this. Like, word, word. And then I walk out. I meet another girl. I was like, oh, yeah. I'm the adviser to, the president of the media.

B And then I meet someone else. I was like, yo. All these people are crazy. Like, this is, like, next level stuff. Right? Like, when we're having sessions, like, yeah. I was running this $15,000,000 business, and then I lost it overnight. And then, this this this. So I'm thinking to myself, I'm like, how did I make it? Yeah.

B And then I later, realized or figured out that, like, oh, the program is for people between the ages of 25 and 40, and I was 25. So I was, like, the youngest part of that cohort, and I was just, like, you know, starting out. So it's just a huge blessing. And out of that, they wanted 5 people who are going to come over to Chicago, for the Obama summit, and, and and be a part of that program. And out of yeah. I don't know. I think 800 with the 2 cards. I was one of the 5 who selected to come over and present about design group with the architects that Obama has hired to to design his presidential center so that we can share notes.

C Oh my gosh. That's so cool.

B So that is crazy. You know what I mean? So it's just like it's it just keeps getting better. So shout out to Obidi, his little father, And, first lady Michelle. Yep.

C That is an incredible story. I'm imagining that you were the One of the few people coming from the built environment architecture specifically into that program. So what Role did you see yourself playing within that group of people who probably are coming from a lot of different industries?

B I don't know. I think when I got to that environment, more than anything, I learned that there's so much more that I need to learn. There's so much growth that I need to have because I think I'll tell Michael the other day that's architecture or going to architecture School is almost a cult. Right? It's like you're taught over and over again that, like, every solution is solved by design and by architecture, which is not necessarily true because, like, in order for architecture to function, you need finance, you need, you know, activists. You need all of these things. So that environment more than me Feeling like I'm playing a role has taught me how I'm a part of a very bigger ecosystem and puzzle that we have to work together in order for us to to bring about that change that we wanna see. President Obama always says that We are the ones we've been waiting for. Right? You know, for far too long, we we sit around as a guy.

B We're waiting for the government to do this. Right? We're waiting for, I don't know who our superiors to do this, the professors, the discipline. Basically, I guess, what President Obama is reminding us, like, yo, no one's going to do it unless we do it. Like, we are the ones we've been waiting for. So that's that's one thing that I've sort of taken out of that is like, well, how can I then use my skills in architecture, to be the one that I've been waiting for, and I think that's how the Ubuntu Architecture Summer Abroad program was born? Because, like, it's one thing for me to be out in social media complaining about, like, social justice, and racism, and systemic racism, and all this stuff. Like but, like, what can I do to start changing that? And then in a very, practical way, I could use this program to start Chipping away at some of those things.

C It reminds me of something that I've thought about a lot, which is I've noticed When people complain about things in society and in their work environment and stuff, they'll often say the phrase, You know, someone really needs to or they need to or, what we should do is and All of those phrases imply that this is someone else's problem. I've identified the problem, and I am putting it onto somebody else to solve. And as leaders, I think that what you're hitting on is so relevant that when we identify problems, Leadership is about taking those problems and actually putting them into action and trying to solve them in the world. So I'm really happy to see all the work that you're doing, and I think That you're making a huge impact, and anybody who gets to participate in this program is gonna be so lucky to come work with you and learn from you. So I hope that If our listeners are hearing this and they're interested that they'll go check it out and and apply for your program.

B Yeah. No. Thank you very much. I think I'm definitely excited to see everyone applies and to be a part of this podcast as well. And I think one of the maybe last few lessons that I'd like to to leave is Don't feel confined to the box of being an architect, right? Just because you started architecture doesn't mean You have to draw building as the only thing that, you know, you use as a tool, either to make impact or if you're Or to make money, you know what I mean? So and I think the more spaces I get into is the more I realize that like, how do I, how do I apply my critical thinking Skills into this space and be able to navigate them and and be able to create that same level of impact. And as you saw, like, We have a very specific mission of creating this inclusive architecture. But you, as you saw with what I was saying, it's like, we're not doing it in one way. We're Find we're trying to find innovative ways.

B Like, I've learned so much about, like, banking and finance and mortgages and work with, you know, my friend at Wall Street is building his financial models and all that stuff to, you know, to working with shipping container, To learning about autism and and therapy and all this stuff. And I think Vitruvio says that an architect is everything. Right? You become a doctor, if you decided for a doctor, you become in, you know, all these things. So I think people need to because I think, I I say this because I remember when I was graduating architecture school, everyone had, like, these internships lined up, and, I didn't have one because I didn't apply. And all these professors are asking me, and I had already started a winter, but it's, like, very early stages. Was like, hey. Do you want me to connect to today? So are you applying? And I was like, no. I I'm fine.

B I don't want to. But I I was also feeling the peer pressure. I was like, oh, maybe there's something wrong with I remember talking to my friend, Victor Perez from, Puerto Rico. And I was like, bro, like, Everyone has this internship, and everyone is going to work at an office. I don't want to work in an office. I know I'll just, like, die if I go there. But at the same time, like, I don't have, like you know what I mean? It's like, I don't even know if I want to do architecture after this. I remember Victor turning to me and saying, bro, you're the one who's doing architecture.

B Architecture is not doing you. It's like, you know, when I'm when I feel tired of this, I can just leave it. I still have a master, which is incredible. I could do something else or this or that or combine it, etcetera. And even though that's, like, a very simple statement, but it was affirming to me, Like, there's so much more that you could do.

C Evelyn, this was your first time hearing One Daily speak, and I wanted to start by Can you to share what stood out to you during the conversation?

D Yeah. So I think, You know, in his own way, his story is uniquely his, but it's not unique to An entrepreneur in the sense that especially an entrepreneur that really wants to go out and do good in his community. I think the best leaders And the best entrepreneurs out there really talk very openly and are realistic about all of the struggles and the failures and the challenges they have faced On the path to creating what they have made today. And they are also, you know, like Wendy Lee from From a very, young age, they are also incredible hustlers.

C Exactly. I I definitely think that He had that entrepreneurial spirit at a young age. I think the main takeaway for this episode is that Social entrepreneurs identify problems in the world that really bother them and then they pursue these incredible careers in pursuit of trying to solve these problems through their businesses. And Juan Daley's business is a great case study in how to take an architectural education and expand that into social justice work and service to a community.

D Yeah. I also think it's important to call out And highlight the fact that being an entrepreneur means that you're committed to continually learning. So in order for him to Build upon his dream of delivering affordable housing, you know, Juan Dealey has had to learn about a variety of different things relative to financing. And he ultimately landed on microloans. And he had to understand enough to Build a business model around microloans so he can practice the kind of architecture that he really wants to, but also His clients are able to pay him for not only the housing that they need over their heads, but also to enable him to continue to do that work.

C I also really appreciate that part of Juan Dealey's message to our audience is about mental health And the reality that entrepreneurship can be isolating, this is really true, and this is something that I've grappled with in my 1st year Doing this full time. He he also shared and was very honest about, his insight and how he manages both his Successes and his failures, and I think that's key. You have to know how to push yourself forward when you get, You know, into the isolating part where it's negative, in order to get to those highs and to the successes, how to keep going when it gets really hard. To our aspiring and current entrepreneurs out there listening, I just wanna say that you are not alone. Part of Evelyn and my work in creating this podcast and our our community, The Practice of Architecture, is to Show you that there is a broader architectural community out there, including entrepreneurs. And we hope to bring like minds together celebrate all the great work that's happening and include those who are looking to, branch away from traditional practice because we think that Community is really important, and previously, people who maybe didn't identify as a capital a architect We're excluded from a lot of these conversations or felt undervalued in some way. And we think that they should be part of this Architectural community because we think that they bring a lot of value to the conversation. So another takeaway that I heard from the conversation was this idea that There's value in expanding your community and to that point, basically, broadening your community ultimately helps you become a better Architect.

C And there are a lot of different pathways to achieve this. In Juan Daley's instance, he mentions how joining the Obama Foundation leaders Brought him into a group of 200 leaders with very diverse viewpoints. And for him, he was One of 2 people thinking about the built environment, and he's being exposed to all of these different leadership styles focused on solving problems that are Beyond what he has been focusing on for the past few years of his career. And Evelyn and I both had the same experience when we went for our MBAs And had classmates who were focused on topics that were outside of what we were used to talking about in architecture.

D Yeah. So for me when I went and got my MBA, I was in this unique cross roads because I had decided I wanted to leave the profession, but I had no idea where I I wanted to go, and I felt that I actually I was deeply involved in the AIA. I was coming off of a 3 year term of being the National Associates Committee chair, and serving on a on board. And I took an active break when I went to school. I made every decision To step away from anything building related even the social clubs. So nothing related to real estate and development and didn't participate in the green building club. Anybody that was looking even at prefab business models, I steered clear with. I didn't, You know, I rarely even really mentioned that I was an architect, so people would come to me to be a part of that group.

D And what it ultimately made me realize was what I actually missed about the profession, but it also provided a clear vision of what I hoped to as an architect in this space. And it's really then when I came back to the profession That I began having conversations about the necessity to evolve the way we practice because I could see the need having stepped away.

C Yeah. And a lot of my classmates in my MBA program came from other backgrounds like education or non profit work or they were Following these nontraditional career paths and maybe sometimes were first generation college students altogether. And I quickly realized that My language that I was coming into the MBA program with was ArchiSpeak. And I needed to broaden my communication strategy to Be better at sharing my ideas that I wanted to within this new community. There were things that were Important to them that were different than the things that I had typically bonded with my architecture studio classmates over, In terms of, like, shared interests and values, so I I immediately, during that 1st year, had to stretch and and kinda grow out of my comfort zone and learn, you know, what were the ideas that were important to them, and there was kinda like this emerging cultural language that was developing in In the 1st part of my MBA studies, around a new set of shared values that we were discovering together as classmates.

D Yes. I think that that big takeaway is just there there is a lot to learn from stepping away from practice, And take opportunities that you have to to do that. It doesn't necessarily have to be an MBA program. That's a very large commitment, both in time and money, but find unique experiences to explore other ways that you can learn from those outside the Profession. So before we close, I want to make sure that we mentioned the applications for the Mventu study abroad Program close on October 30th. For listeners who are still in school, I believe you have to at least be a 3rd year, student. For those who are more experienced and have some additional financial needs, Wandelia is still looking for sponsorships. If there are any listeners who would like to support our students' participation in that program.

D We'll be sure to include more in the show notes. Thank you for listening, and be sure to tune in next week. Thanks for joining us on Practice Disrupted, a podcast by Practice of Architecture. Visit us at practice disrupted.com To find out more about future episodes and the changing nature of practice, this show is part of the Gable Media Podcast Network. You can learn more about other podcasts in our community by visiting gablmedia.com. If you enjoy the show and want to hear more content like this, You can help us by leaving a rating, review, and subscribing on your favorite podcast app. Don't forget to share with your friends, and feel free to let us know what other topics or speakers you are interested in hearing about. Thanks for listening, and see you next